2010+ Mazdaspeed 3, I recommend to monitor your fuel pumps closely

[Nazarite]

Originally Posted by char181 Accept my apology please. This was unintentional. I am working off of my iPhone and my big fingers don't always work well on this small screen. No harm.....no foul. Really

Hahahaha, oh man, finally the mystery is solved. Carry on.

[Nataphen]

I'm going to give the PTP big bore internals a try. I will be monitoring it very closely, and I'll let you guys know how things go. I'm also going to try an e85 tune and I'll keep you all updated on that as well. I know that PTP doesn't have a good rep for several good reasons, but I don't see why I can't try and see how it goes for you guys. Looks like I'll be the guinea pig again, but it's for the development of this platform. Hopefully, I won't be taking a bullet on the e85 and/or the pump tests, LOL. Stay tuned.

[Mchart]

Originally Posted by Nataphen I'm going to give the PTP big bore internals a try. I will be monitoring it very closely, and I'll let you guys know how things go. I'm also going to try an e85 tune and I'll keep you all updated on that as well. I know that PTP doesn't have a good rep for several good reasons, but I don't see why I can't try and see how it goes for you guys. Looks like I'll be the guinea pig again, but it's for the development of this platform. Hopefully, I won't be taking a bullet on the e85 and/or the pump tests, LOL. Stay tuned.

Don't the big bore internals require a bigger in tank pump to be worth it?

[Amazon]

Why Nagga, WHY? Don't try the brand with the worst name in the business. If you could call them one, last I heard, they don't have a business license even. They cost $100 more than KMD.

Before you do this, talk to gigs and triple.

[drenkel]

Originally Posted by senor blanco ms3 This is a weak test. All you proved is that one out of how ever many worked fine. If you want to provide conclusive evidence that it's the install and not the material, then you need a larger sample from the same batch.

The internals are all machined and have tolerance specs they have to meet. It's not like the parts are very complicated. It's a metal rod, a sleeve and a retainer clip. Any respectable machine shop should be able to get that right 99.9% of the time.

I agree with Joe, failures on the internals are most likely due to user error on the installation. I'd be willing to bet a good portion of the failures are from someone setting the damn thing down on a dirty work bench while they put it together, or from doing it in your driveway and letting wind & dust get inside the hole while the pump is off the engine.

Even the how-to posted in the Gen 1 section is wrong. It says to soak the internals in a can of gasoline while you are working on them. DONT DO THAT! lol. One of the mods needs to fix that post.

If your not mechanically inclined, get the CP-e pump and don't worry about it. If you got some common sense and are used to working on cars a bit, the internals are not that hard to install.

[jmac36]

Originally Posted by Mchart Don't the big bore internals require a bigger in tank pump to be worth it?

Simple answer, Nate wants to go 100% e85 and as we all know ya need lots more e85 to make the same pwr. It's all about safety and having the headroom to do it

[char181]

Originally Posted by Amazon lol I feel your pain, trying to text or type with my fat fingers + little buttons = RAGE

Originally Posted by Nataphen I'm going to give the PTP big bore internals a try. I will be monitoring it very closely, and I'll let you guys know how things go. I'm also going to try an e85 tune and I'll keep you all updated on that as well. I know that PTP doesn't have a good rep for several good reasons, but I don't see why I can't try and see how it goes for you guys. Looks like I'll be the guinea pig again, but it's for the development of this platform. Hopefully, I won't be taking a bullet on the e85 and/or the pump tests, LOL. Stay tuned.

WOW... Now I can finally "come out of the closet". I installed the PTP internals a couple of months ago and don't seem to have a problem. I say don't seem because I have no way to monitor yet. I am stock now and waiting on the AP before modding this spring. Please post your findings as soon as you can. I would really be interested. I was anal about the cleanliness issue when I installed the internals on my gen2 having only 3000 miles on the clock. I hope this does not reignite the "I hate John" threads.

[Amazon]

Ok, I understand that PTP is the only one with support for e85 at this time, still, I would use caution.

[senor blanco ms3]

Originally Posted by drenkel The internals are all machined and have tolerance specs they have to meet. It's not like the parts are very complicated. It's a metal rod, a sleeve and a retainer clip. Any respectable machine shop should be able to get that right 99.9% of the time. I agree with Joe, failures on the internals are most likely due to user error on the installation. I'd be willing to bet a good portion of the failures are from someone setting the damn thing down on a dirty work bench while they put it together, or from doing it in your driveway and letting wind & dust get inside the hole while the pump is off the engine. Even the how-to posted in the Gen 1 section is wrong. It says to soak the internals in a can of gasoline while you are working on them. DONT DO THAT! lol. One of the mods needs to fix that post. If your not mechanically inclined, get the CP-e pump and don't worry about it. If you got some common sense and are used to working on cars a bit, the internals are not that hard to install.

Ok, how do you explain a failure rate of x% when the same person, who is a professional, has installed internals on several cars?

It's unfortunate that all the faulty internals have been sent back already because you can tell that the material was the common problem among all the bad kits.

[Nataphen]

I am using caution, and I'm not recommending that ANYONE do what I'm planning to do. I am using the PTP big bore to support the increased volume for e85. Like you said, Ama, it's the only one out there that would be able to do it right now. If CPE had a big bore pump, I'd use it.

My recommendations from the OP aren't changing due to this little experiment, but sometimes, you have to take risks to push the platform. I think that running e85 in this car may be able to take it to the next level so that we can unlock some power. Then again, it may all go down in flames. I will be datalogging 100% of the time for a good long time, probably a whole year, so I can see all different temps and weather.

You guys just sit back and watch the show, we'll know if this is worth a damn after a little real world R&D.

Joe, do you think that any other parts of the fuel system will need an upgrade for this? I don't want to blow if I can help it, pretty sure that that's a given. Are you sure that the other components of the system will support this volume? Mchart mentioned possibly needing a higher volume in tank pump for example.

[Amazon]

Will there be fireworks?


hehe

[jmac36]

Originally Posted by Amazon Ok, I understand that PTP is the only one with support for e85 at this time, still, I would use caution.

I'm not saying one way or the other about John his self, cause I don't know him. But the stuff did show up when we ordered it, the instructions were decent, and the parts did the job.

Blanco, yes your right, it was a small sample, but like I said, it was done for our own information, and btw out of my pocket, so if the info is not useful to ya, I'm sorry. Its not meant to be end all be all for pumps, just information if you can use it.

For what its worth, we are going to run PTP in one of the race cars, and KMD in the other, and see what happens. Both cars have Aim MXL data dashes, so everything gets logged............

[Nataphen]

Originally Posted by Amazon Will there be fireworks? hehe

God I hope not. BBQ at my place if there are though...or wherever I breakdown.

[Nataphen]

Aw, Amy and Mono, you don't like me for what I've said I see. I still say that nobody else should try this, I'm not telling anyone to go out and buy PTP products. I still recommend ONLY CPE pumps and KMD internals to everyone else. The only reason I'm doing this is for the e85 fueling support, I'm just as worried about the pump as anyone else.

[ebnash]

Can someone elaborate on e85. Is this a different kind of pump??? Searching using "e85" is unsuccessful...

Fuck never mind, I just found info on google. This is an ethanol fuel type?

For what its worth, I spoke with CP-E yesterday and the lady I spoke with said they should be about 1 week out for the next batch of pumps.

I am planning on ordering a CP-E pump and KMD internals kit and keeping my core for a spare!

[jmac36]

Originally Posted by ebnash Can someone elaborate on e85. Is this a different kind of pump??? Searching using "e85" is unsuccessful... Fuck never mind, I just found info on google. This is an ethanol fuel type?

Eric, not different really just larger bore, so more fuel per stoke of the pump. More volume = less chance of using more fuel than the pump can supply. Thats the real issue with the stock Hitatchi pump, its right at the limit on delivery volume for the stock cars. Run out of volume= drop in pressure= bad

[Nataphen]

Yes, it is 70%-85% ethanol. If the fuel system will handle 100% e85, you can basically run a 110+ octane tune all the time, and the fuel only costs $2.50 a gallon rather than race gas prices. I am told that it's a good idea to fill up with premium about every fourth tank because of the decrease in lubricant from e85. This, in theory, keeps things from getting overly dried out.

[rfinkle2]

on this note (pumps) has anyone heard from Gerry @ AR designs? i.e. i was on the list for a pump since mid December.

[Nataphen]

Still on BO last I heard from him, rfinkle.

[drenkel]

Originally Posted by senor blanco ms3 Ok, how do you explain a failure rate of x% when the same person, who is a professional, has installed internals on several cars? It's unfortunate that all the faulty internals have been sent back already because you can tell that the material was the common problem among all the bad kits.

I did say "respectable" lol. I've never done business with John, but from all the problems I've read about with his customer service I wouldn't classify him in the "respectable" category.

Maybe he cut corners with the materials he was using, maybe he had problems with storage / transit... I dunno. Where PTP really failed on this forum was with his customer service and business ethics. Maybe he did take a shortcut somewhere, but we'll never know.

[rfinkle2]

Originally Posted by Nataphen Still on BO last I heard from him, rfinkle.

thank you sir. are u on the list also?

first it was immediate delivery, then mid January, now I'm hearing whisperings of 2-3 more weeks...

[Nataphen]

I wasn't on the list, but I talk with him from time to time. 2-3 weeks was what he said earlier this week.

drenkel, senor, simmer down. I do not recommend doing business with PTP, I'm using that pump out of necessity for this project. Don't think for a second that I'm going to start telling people to buy them.

[drenkel]

Originally Posted by Nataphen I wasn't on the list, but I talk with him from time to time. 2-3 weeks was what he said earlier this week. drenkel, senor, simmer down. I do not recommend doing business with PTP, I'm using that pump out of necessity for this project. Don't think for a second that I'm going to start telling people to buy them.

Not arguing with him at all Nata, we are having a conversation. Good luck with the e85, I'm really interested to see how it turns out.

[rfinkle2]

Originally Posted by Nataphen I wasn't on the list, but I talk with him from time to time. 2-3 weeks was what he said earlier this week.

I pm'd him yesterday, but didn't get an answer... but i trust he's busy or didn't get it yet.

I've waited this long... lol

[Amazon]

Originally Posted by Nataphen Aw, Amy and Mono, you don't like me for what I've said I see. I still say that nobody else should try this, I'm not telling anyone to go out and buy PTP products. I still recommend ONLY CPE pumps and KMD internals to everyone else. The only reason I'm doing this is for the e85 fueling support, I'm just as worried about the pump as anyone else.

Our groans are groans of care and caution. Also for "I told you so" rights for possible future reference. I can't pass on a good set up

[rfinkle2]

Originally Posted by Nataphen Yes, it is 70%-85% ethanol. If the fuel system will handle 100% e85, you can basically run a 110+ octane tune all the time, and the fuel only costs $2.50 a gallon rather than race gas prices. I am told that it's a good idea to fill up with premium about every fourth tank because of the decrease in lubricant from e85. This, in theory, keeps things from getting overly dried out.

i wish i had e85 in my area (south jersey). There were a number of people in the evo crowd running it and they picked up BIG power.

AND... your tailpipe stays squeaky clean.

[ebnash]

Originally Posted by rfinkle2 thank you sir. are u on the list also? first it was immediate delivery, then mid January, now I'm hearing whisperings of 2-3 more weeks...

AR over extended himself because he is just drop shipping from CP-E. Only CP-E knows how many pumps are available at any given time unless AR actually buys some inventory up front and manages it himself.

[Nataphen]

Exactly why I want to give it a shot. I'm just not totally sure that our MZR DI system will hold up to it. I'm getting everything set up with Joe right now, we're going to start small and see where/when problems arise. If I monitor constantly, I can always just switch back to 93 octane if it doesn't work out.

[rfinkle2]

Originally Posted by Nataphen Exactly why I want to give it a shot. I'm just not totally sure that our MZR DI system will hold up to it. I'm getting everything set up with Joe right now, we're going to start small and see where/when problems arise. If I monitor constantly, I can always just switch back to 93 octane if it doesn't work out.

I thank you for trying it.

FWIW, everyone was scared of e85 on the evo until a few tuners and drivers took the plunge. Now, if it is available in the area, it is pretty much a staple for those looking for custom tuning.

BTW... the guy who tuned my car (super competent) owned an evo himself which was tuned on e85. after a solid year of running it, he took apart everything that was said to be @ risk for deterioration, and not only did everything look fine, it was clean too.

depending on if you still have q's or not, there is alot of good info on e85 on evolutionm.net and the forum is actually quite friendly.

[Dre]

From what ive heard regarding the KMD's failing, it was installation fail.. my KMD's have been running on my car for about 9k miles with full intake, ets tmic, and dp/rp.. currently running AP as well in 20-40 deg FL weather without issue.. gettin PSI as high as 2000.. these same internals were on aaronc7's car for 40-50k miles and ran hard with no issue.. so there's another testimonial for KMDs on a genpu (not that it matters which gen, but im sure to some folks it does)..

and not all stock pumps are made equal.. like some others that have posted here, my stock pump was holding up quite well with sri/tip, dp/rp, stock tmic.. holding 1650+ during WOT operation.. but i couldnt pass up aaron's deal when he parted out (lol ama)..

and if you havent modded your car yet , or are slightly modded and are looking for a way to monitor.. borrow someones DH and check your DI Pressure.. if its holding fine then wait for the AP , which will monitor/log/tune all in one package.. its the best $330 (lol x2 ama) ive spent so far on the car..

[Amazon]

Originally Posted by Dre but i couldnt pass up aaron's deal when he parted out (lol ama)

FFFUUU

That was totally uncalled for faggot

[senor blanco ms3]

Originally Posted by drenkel I did say "respectable" lol. I've never done business with John, but from all the problems I've read about with his customer service I wouldn't classify him in the "respectable" category. Maybe he cut corners with the materials he was using, maybe he had problems with storage / transit... I dunno. Where PTP really failed on this forum was with his customer service and business ethics. Maybe he did take a shortcut somewhere, but we'll never know.

I'm not talking about John.

[ebnash]

Originally Posted by ROADWAR I wonder if CPE would build a new one that I purchased from Mazda? Anyone have an idea what a new one from Mazda costs?

Years ago, I worked at a Mazda dealership in the parts department. Called up my buddy that is still there and retail on a new HPFP is 484.89. My cost is 310.00. Kinda makes you wonder why CP-E is valuing these cores at $375.00...

[wolly6973]

Originally Posted by ebnash Can someone elaborate on e85. Is this a different kind of pump??? Searching using "e85" is unsuccessful... Fuck never mind, I just found info on google. This is an ethanol fuel type? For what its worth, I spoke with CP-E yesterday and the lady I spoke with said they should be about 1 week out for the next batch of pumps. I am planning on ordering a CP-E pump and KMD internals kit and keeping my core for a spare!

People keeping the cores is part of the problem as to why CP-E can't keep up with demand...

They upgrade the cores they get back.

So if you don't send yours back, someone else will have to wait even longer to get theirs.

Plus, if you can get it for $310 from your parts guy, you are losing $$!

[ebnash]

Originally Posted by wolly6973 People keeping the cores is part of the problem as to why CP-E can't keep up with demand... They upgrade the cores they get back. So if you don't send yours back, someone else will have to wait even longer to get theirs. Plus, if you can get it for $310 from your parts guy, you are losing $$!

Wow, now I really feel guilty. Give me a break

[Speed3eak]

Nate, I'm really excited to see your results running e85.

$2.50 a gallon 110 octane > $3.3x a gallon 93 octane

Even if you get a few less mpg's it's well worth it IMO. Between this and driver311's thread about e85, I'm excited to see what e85 can do for the ms3.

[Mchart]

Upgraded my pump today.. To tired to go out and drive and see if it holds or not. Install was mostly painless besides that nearly impossible to access 19mm nut on the underside. Just enough free space between all the lines to be able to turn a short stubby little wrench.

[ebnash]

Originally Posted by Mchart Upgraded my pump today.. To tired to go out and drive and see if it holds or not. Install was mostly painless besides that nearly impossible to access 19mm nut on the underside. Just enough free space between all the lines to be able to turn a short stubby little wrench.

Out of curiosity, did you remove your intake and inlet pipe for the installation?

Thanks

[Mchart]

Originally Posted by ebnash Out of curiosity, did you remove your intake and inlet pipe for the installation? Thanks

In order to easily access that 19mm nut on the underside easily you need to remove the battery/batterybox/ECU and inlet pipe.

However, if you have a stubby little 19mm wrench you should be able to have just enough room in the space between all the lines back there to break the nut loose and tighten it. The nut only needs half a turn either way to lock it in place, or break it loose enough to remove it by hand.

Or, if you are smart, just buy a 19mm crowsfoot. Really easy to loosen/tighten that nut then. In fact, i'd say anyone doing the pump install should make sure they buy one because it would make the install a hell of a lot faster compared to removing all that shit, or fumbling around with a stubby wrench.

[Monotonous ONE]

battery removal is not necessary in the least