corksport blog- TIP

[dhsieh911018]

CorkSport Mazda Performance ? Blog » Why Innovate??

so CS's TIP is better than SURE, COBB, CPE... any other brand that utilizes the same silicone design?

CS is implying the heat resistance ability of the silicone design is BS.

discuss

[Todd98SE]

Originally Posted by dhsieh911018 CorkSport Mazda Performance ? Blog » Why Innovate?? so CS's TIP is better than SURE, COBB, CPE... any other brand that utilizes the same silicone design? CS is implying the heat resistance ability of the silicone design is BS. discuss

It is BS.

[Easter Bunny]

Originally Posted by Todd98SE It is BS.

/thread

[hamfisted]

It seems kind of pointless to worry about the thermal resistance of the TIP when you're installing a SRI that sucks air from the hot engine bay instead of from the front of the car like the OEM airbox.

Didn't stop me from installing the CS SRI & TIP. As long as the intercooler does its job and keeps BAT low, I'm not worried about it.

[Littlescroll]

Yeah it's got to be a minimal difference at best. In the real world I doubt you'd have much difference in whp between a metal or silicone tip anyway.

Edit: that said, corksport still got my money and I'd do it again. Great customer service, products, and marketing.

[caesura]

Weird how they released this "information" a week after JBR comes out with new products.... Total bs

[silvapain]

At least they have some test data, and just didn't make claims without backing.

They're trying to sell product and make money. This shouldn't be a surprise to you.

[sidekick]

Why do you guys even have beef with this? Show me where all the other manufacturers did anything to prove their design works...

Don't worry, I'll wait...

[Stingray69]

Having read a shitload of threads about intakes I thought we all agreed there was not a lot of difference between intakes? I bought the CS because the SRI and TIP package is offered at an attractive price. A company is marketing their product to PROFIT what's the problem?

[breakfstincluded]

metal has more wooosh

[sidekick]

Originally Posted by breakfstincluded metal has more wooosh

Metal doesn't just have more wooosh lol. Its LOUD with the K04's insta-spool. At least the HTP I have is.

[Dr. Speed]

MOAR turbo sound = win

[GreyGhost]

I love my CS TIP and Intake, just switched to HTP because of it's 3" one-piece design.

[CorkSport]

We had another company do the testing on the flow of the TIPs and we were really surprised about the flow data which is what prompted the blog post. Say BS is you want but we do have data to support the flow claims.

-Derrick

[Todd98SE]

Originally Posted by CorkSport We had another company do the testing on the flow of the TIPs and we were really surprised about the flow data which is what prompted the blog post. Say BS is you want but we do have data to support the flow claims. -Derrick

Derrick the BS claim refers to the false assumption that silicone is somehow better than metal for an inlet pipe.

I don't think anyone is disputing your CFM claims.

Keep up the good work, your products are top notch.

[Crarrs]

Originally Posted by caesura Weird how they released this "information" a week after JBR comes out with new products.... Total bs

What's weird about it? Or is that a horribly veiled attempt at sarcasm?

They've had this on the market for years, as they've stated. Somebody else has something new. So what if they're reminding people of their own proven product.

Let's see the data that proves the new vendor has anything with better performance.

[Dr. Speed]

I don't think there's anything wrong with Corksport's blog post. They presented objective data and reminded people that their product is awesome Nice to know that their metal TIP design outflows some of the silicone designs out there. I personally ordered a 3" HTP intake because I wanted bigger, but the CS piece is no doubt a very nice product with the data and reviews to back it up.

[JBR]

I as well think it's kinda coincidental that the blog entry and Facebook post was made shortly after the release of our Power Path intakes too but I'm certainly not paranoid nor am I going to sweat it. I do think it does deserve a response though since we are "discussing" it.

Let it be known I'm not starting a war. I have a very hi-level of respect for Corksport.

I can't speak for "Brand-X" TIP identified in Corksports blog post but, I can speak for ours.

Points that I think should be taken in to consideration.....

There's a significant amount of data out there to support that silicone is a much better insulator from heat than metal is. Some may argue that when it comes to the TIP that it doesn't matter because it's an SRI anyway, well it does. Will just adding a silicone TIP make a noticeable difference, no, but when combined with other heat reducing mods, that all adds up and equal better performance. A perfect example to support this is why people put header wrap or gold foil on metal intakes, to deflect the heat and reduce the heat soak as much as possible because a silicone option is not available.

Did we flow bench ours TIP vs. stock vs. CS no, Why? Well it's pretty obvious anything will flow better than stock so I saw no point in throwing good money away to prove that. Now here's what I believe is really important....Our TIP has a full 2.5" cross sectional internal dimension from inlet side all the way to just before entering the turbo at which time it transitions very smoothly down to the size of the turbo. No, 2.5" aluminum turbo inlet pipe has an internal dimension of 2.5" and must be mated to the turbo utilizing a coupler. The pipe is often bead rolled further reducing flow and adding turbulence. Again, I can’t speak for "Brand-X" but, I'm confident our silicone TIP will perform as well if not better than any metal TIP. I also can’t help but think there's a reason that more companies make them out of silicone vs. aluminum and I can assure you, it's not because it's easier and cheaper to make. I know, I make both.

In summary I think they both will serve equally well.

Quality, Cost, $0 cost for shipping and the lifetime warranty are what I strive so hard to provide in each and every one of our products.

[caesura]

Originally Posted by Crarrs What's weird about it? Or is that a horribly veiled attempt at sarcasm? They've had this on the market for years, as they've stated. Somebody else has something new. So what if they're reminding people of their own proven product. Let's see the data that proves the new vendor has anything with better performance.

Sarcasm...They didn't release any data charts in their post they simply stated some numbers, so no real proof of said claims. I'm not knocking Corksport, I think they have good products, just if they are going to come out and say how innovative they are they should have released some more info other than just numbers that anyone could pull out their butts.

[darkcambria]

Originally Posted by caesura Sarcasm...They didn't release any data charts in their post they simply stated some numbers, so no real proof of said claims. I'm not knocking Corksport, I think they have good products, just if they are going to come out and say how innovative they are they should have released some more info other than just numbers that anyone could pull out their butts.

So why not ask Derrick for the charts? 90% of the people don't really care, they just want spoon fed info and they'll believe whatever they're told. Meanwhile Corksport goes out and has their products tested by someone else. I'm sure they'd be forthcoming with the actual data if you ask.

[CWP_MS3]

This entire thread is ridiculous...

Some people run CS, some people run Cobb, some people run JBR. No one has examples of them dynoing significantly higher than someone else running something different. Throughout all of the different variations of parts we can have on our cars, with solid tunes, I've never seen anyone have an exceptional amount over anyone else at any of our dyno events. Most bolted cars that I've seen, that are tuned, tend to put down relatively close numbers as other people with other setups. And any difference between them isn't going to be significant.

Your tune is going to be the determining factor versus a pipe that is roughly the same diameter as someone else's pipe but made of a different material.

[Tyhackman15]

Originally Posted by jbarone In summary I think they both will serve equally well. Quality, Cost, $0 cost for shipping and the lifetime warranty are what I strive so hard to provide in each and every one of our products.

I just wanted to reiterate this, a huge deal IMO

[CorkSport]

Originally Posted by dhsieh911018 CorkSport Mazda Performance ? Blog » Why Innovate?? so CS's TIP is better than SURE, COBB, CPE... any other brand that utilizes the same silicone design? CS is implying the heat resistance ability of the silicone design is BS. discuss

No one implied that silicone does not resist heat better than Metal. It does. But a silicone pipe will eventually reach the same temperature as the metal pipe. The claim is that it will transfer that heat to the air traveling by it. Documentation shows that it does not. Even on a dyno with the hood down it does not. That is the only claim being made.

Dimensions of pipe have nothing to do with flow. Flow comes from smooth bends and low turbulence. We initially flow tested our TIP when it was designed many years ago. We then flow tested them again with all the rest of the TIPs we have. This was more a design study of other parts we are producing and how the operate together. We just happen to test a silicone one with it. We found the information interesting and posted it. As far as I can tell no one else has flow tested there pipes or they don't post up the data from those tests. I myself have been surprised that things that you think would flow better do not flow better.

I can combine the flow charts together and post them up but it might take awhile. i have a drawer full of flow testing data on the MS3/MS6. Factory parts/Aftermarket parts and limits of each.

Hope this is useful information.

Originally Posted by caesura Sarcasm...They didn't release any data charts in their post they simply stated some numbers, so no real proof of said claims. I'm not knocking Corksport, I think they have good products, just if they are going to come out and say how innovative they are they should have released some more info other than just numbers that anyone could pull out their butts.

This was suppose to be done before this was posted. The person combining them went home ill. Hope you understand we are not pulling numbers out of the air. I will post them up. I'm also open to any data that states otherwise.

[caesura]

This was suppose to be done before this was posted. The person combining them went home ill. Hope you understand we are not pulling numbers out of the air. I will post them up. I'm also open to any data that states otherwise.[/QUOTE]

Just to clarify I'm not saying the numbers aren't true, I'm saying that the data and charts should be presented when making claims as such. Corksport has been one of the biggest innovators on this platform and has helped the community so much, just hate when people pull claims on their product from the air saying it's better without any proof.

[CorkSport]

Originally Posted by caesura This was suppose to be done before this was posted. The person combining them went home ill. Hope you understand we are not pulling numbers out of the air. I will post them up. I'm also open to any data that states otherwise. Just to clarify I'm not saying the numbers aren't true, I'm saying that the data and charts should be presented when making claims as such. Corksport has been one of the biggest innovators on this platform and has helped the community so much, just hate when people pull claims on their product from the air saying it's better without any proof.

No big deal I will get the sheets up.

[JBR]

Internal pipe dimension plays a significant roll in flow or there would be no reason for us to run larger intakes and TIP's on the stock turbo. Agreed, smooth bends and low turbulence contribute to good flow.

[sidekick]

Originally Posted by jbarone Internal pipe dimension plays a significant roll in flow or there would be no reason for us to run larger intakes and TIP's on the stock turbo. Agreed, smooth bends and low turbulence contribute to good flow.

But the stock K04 can only flow so much air, so it can't necessarily make use of much larger ID intakes. I'd agree with Brydon in the sense that, once you reach a certain intake ID, the most noticeable gains will be from smoother bends in the intake tract on a K04. If you had unlimited flow (ala flowbench testing), you're correct, the larger ID pipe is going to flow more air.

[CorkSport]

Originally Posted by jbarone Internal pipe dimension plays a significant roll in flow or there would be no reason for us to run larger intakes and TIP's on the stock turbo. Agreed, smooth bends and low turbulence contribute to good flow.

True but you can make a 4" pipe that flows like a 2" pipe if you are not careful. Mandrel bent pipes will generally flow well unless you have some crazy bends but when making cast pieces or silicone pieces there is a significant challenge. Some of the very large intakes on the market (Not JBRs) have some very interesting bends that I would guess limit flow significantly. Although I've not acquired any to flow test. But I would like to see a large intake compare as well. This might give you something fun to do on the weekend. My guess is you would win. Just a guess though.

[JBR]

Originally Posted by Brydon@CorkSport True but you can make a 4" pipe that flows like a 2" pipe if you are not careful. Mandrel bent pipes will generally flow well unless you have some crazy bends but when making cast pieces or silicone pieces there is a significant challenge. Some of the very large intakes on the market (Not JBRs) have some very interesting bends that I would guess limit flow significantly.

Absolutely, well put.

Originally Posted by boost_addict But the stock K04 can only flow so much air, so it can't necessarily make use of much larger ID intakes.

This is true, but the K04 can flow more air with a larger intake/TIP than the stock replacements do. There is a limit with the K04, no question.

[ABolewski]

Very interesting thread born from a totally useless thread.

[CorkSport]

As promised:

These have flow test of other things on them so things were blacked out. Also company names were blacked out. The first flow is the original intake elbow. The second is the CorkSport TIP. And in the last pictures in the Brand X Silicone TIP.

[atvfreek]

I made 400hp on a bnr with a cs tip, and 3" maf.

Sent from your couch

[Menace1]

FUCK!
Well there goes any good tip's in the for sale section any time soon!



STICKY! DONT SELL THIS SHIT IN HERE! "BRAND X"

[silvapain]

A point to think about...

If you have a K04 and utilize the stock location or updated location on the intake for the PCV system (by the MAF and by the compressor inlet, respectively), going too big in the intake/TIP can be a bad thing.

The PCV system relies on the vacuum created at the intake to pull pressure out of the crankcase and therefore help the oil drain out of the K04 CHRA. The larger the TIP diameter you use, the slower the air will flow through the TIP and therefore the greater the pressure will be in the TIP. This will create more crankcase pressure, and can prevent oil drainage in the K04 and cause it to smoke.

Mazda moved the PCV connection point on the intake closer to the compressor inlet to create more vacuum on the PCV system. Through testing that @MATT DAMOND; did with my car, on my CP-e intake and CS TIP there was 0 inHg vacuum at the stock location port by the MAF and ~3 inHg vacuum at the PCV port on the CS TIP.

P.S. I commend CorkSport for their testing and willingness to post the data on MSF. Thanks!

[Twofer]

The thing that sold me on the Corksport SRI is that little number on the side of the MAF housing, the CARB EO number.

Such is life in Banifornia.

But in any case, I am very pleased with the CS SRI/TIP.

[CorkSport]

Originally Posted by Menace1 FUCK! Well there goes any good tip's in the for sale section any time soon! STICKY! DONT SELL THIS SHIT IN HERE! "BRAND X"

Lol

Damn brand X!

[Easter Bunny]

Originally Posted by Brydon@CorkSport As promised: These have flow test of other things on them so things were blacked out. Also company names were blacked out. The first flow is the original intake elbow. The second is the CorkSport TIP. And in the last pictures in the Brand X Silicone TIP.

Looks like brand x beats you guys at 1.000 lift. There is no 2.000 lift to compare on brand x.

Might not be the result you guys thought.

[CorkSport]

Originally Posted by Easter Bunny Looks like brand x beats you guys at 1.000 lift. There is no 2.000 lift to compare on brand x. Might not be the result you guys thought.

Easter Bunny:

I'll answer for Brydon because I happen to know that he is out drinking some amazing beer right now (I'm a bit jealous). There was no head involved in our flow testing, therefore there is no lift(s). It's just how the comparison sheet auto-populates. There is no trick to the numbers or the sheets, they were all flow tested the same way with the same machine. These results can be independently checked.

Also, not to cheapen this study... but this level of engineering is just the tip of the iceberg for CorkSport in 2013. We're worried about stepping up our game not worrying about what others are doing.

Any tests you see from us are not to tear down anyone else, (heck, even our results here show that Brand-X is still better than the stock unit), our tests are strictly for us to measure how we are doing and what we are doing to push things further. And to throw out an old cliche'.... You ain't seen nothin yet!!!

[Menace1]

Originally Posted by Joel@CorkSport Easter Bunny: I'll answer for Brydon because I happen to know that he is out drinking some amazing beer right now (I'm a bit jealous). There was no head involved in our flow testing, therefore there is no lift(s). It's just how the comparison sheet auto-populates. There is no trick to the numbers or the sheets, they were all flow tested the same way with the same machine. These results can be independently checked. Also, not to cheapen this study... but this level of engineering is just the tip of the iceberg for CorkSport in 2013. We're worried about stepping up our game not worrying about what others are doing. Any tests you see from us are not to tear down anyone else, (heck, even our results here show that Brand-X is still better than the stock unit), our tests are strictly for us to measure how we are doing and what we are doing to push things further. And to throw out an old cliche'.... You ain't seen nothin yet!!!

Damn! does that mean I should wait to buy some things I need cuz your making new ones.

You jerk!

[CorkSport]

Buy whatever you need Menace, but keep your wallet handy for some new extras coming!