Turbo whining?

[ADHDAdditiv]

Ok so I was driving home, and I noticed my turbo was making a whining noise, like a supercharger.
Only makes the noise when in boost. Nothing changed on the car, I checked for boost leaks as soon as I got home, didnt see anything, will check closer when the engine cools.
Holds the same amount of boost it always does and doesn't feel any less powerful. Any thoughts?

PS: I checked the turbo for play about a month ago, not even a little bit.

Turbo whine - YouTube

Turbo whine - YouTube

[aaronc7]

how about a better video first.

[ADHDAdditiv]

I'll see what I can do. Might be a couple hours though.

[Hargarbl]

Yeah a 2 second video is really hard to get anything from. I would double check your turbo. I had a slight whine from mine and when i went to install my DP i noticed some shaft play and some marks on the housing. Had it rebuilt (brand new CHRA, cheaper than new, about the same cost as I was finding used) and the whine was gone.

[ADHDAdditiv]

Ok here is another video

The whining isnt as load as before, but it did get loader after I finished the video. Here's hoping this is what you need.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXOQISlW0q0

[IshiKage]

Sounds like you may have a leak or the turbo is going. HOw many miles on the car?

[ADHDAdditiv]

105k km so around 65k?
Been having boost issues since I bought the car though. I might have a crack in my turbo inlet pipe. Bought a sure one from a guy here on the forum should be here soon

[Speedracer69]

Just replaced my ko4 with a bnrs3 and it was smoking and making a whine noise. Noise is now gone so it is probably your turbo going out.

[MSMS3]

Not hitting the alarm button yet, based on your posts, but I just had a turbo failure that began with the vanes of the compressor side of the turbo rubbing the housing. In hindsight, I realize there was some whining, most notable when just lightly going on and off boost.

you could have several other causes, but one of the things you should do at that mileage (mine is 108k) is to remove the battery and the turbo inlet pipe and visually inspect the compressor to see if there is play in the shaft and if there is any indication that the vanes are rubbing the housing. You will need a strong light and get the angle just right. Not only were there scrape marks on mine, but one of the vanes had been fractured and part of it got sucked through the intake and into the engine. I was lucky that it passed through with no damage.

I posted a separate thread on this.

Chase down the more likely causes, but do inspect the compressor wheel while you are at it.

[SpencerC]

My turbo made a similar noise for awhile. It didn't appear to have any play/movement. Still made noise. Checked a second time and it looked like @MSMS3; said. "indication that the vanes are rubbing the housing."

Before this I had done boost leak tests and narrowed all of those out.

The odd thing was my noise would come and go. If I hit enough boost it would actually totally stop whining, then for the next few pulls or days it would be fine. Then it would randomly start again.

Ultimately the turbo needed replacing. I was at 120,000 miles though.

[Shredhead86]

Sorry if this is a stupid question. I’m still very much a turbo noob. My speed6 (126,000) just started making this sound yesterday. My question is should I replace the turbo immediately or can I just drive like a little old lady for the time being? I’m not sure if I ha e the extra money to drop on something like this right now.

[MSMS3]

Hard to say. Might run fine for awhile. But, if it a vane strike, think about what will happen if a vane breaks. It gets sucked through the IC, through the intake manifold, an intake valve and into the combustion chamber as a piston is coming up on compression.

That's a recipe for zoom, zoom boom. Then, if it and the engine survive, it gets expelled from an exhaust valve, through the turbo impeller and out the exhaust to get trapped in and clog up your catalytic converter. Yet a second chance to screw you.

I would not want to take that chance. If there are strike marks on the inside of compressor (cold side) it will look likely scrapes on the aluminum where the vanes rotate like propeller blades. If you see that or see any actual vanes that are broken, it is not safe to operate.

I actually broke a vane. It managed to pass through somehow. I was lucky. You may not be.

You may just have a big pre turbo air leak. It would take a very large one to hear that type sound. That's bad, too, as unfiltered air has micro particles of silica (sand) which is abrasive to engine internals.

[speed23]

I suggest to disconnect intake and look at turbo; feel how much shaft play and see if there are wear marks from the vanes rubbing. The turbo impeller will have a little shaft play on k04 but shouldn't be crazy.

[Shredhead86]

There is a little bit of play in the shaft. Not a lot. I’m beginning to think this may be an issue with a leak around the BOV.

[Fstrnyou]

Those blades looks like ass, but I don't see anything broken/missing.

Check for leaks. If you can hear it in the cabin, I would start with the turbo outlet.

[speed23]

Whats wearing those blades down like that on the leading edge? You running pre-turbo water/meth injection? lol

At least it doesnt appear they are worn or rubbing on the housing though...at least that I can see in the pic.

[MoMS3]

Originally Posted by Shredhead86 There is a little bit of play in the shaft. Not a lot. I’m beginning to think this may be an issue with a leak around the BOV.

Yeah your compressor wheel is shot, and given the amount missing from the vanes, I wouldn't be surprised if the entire rotating assembly is out of balance. You'll want to get that turbo swapped out asap because it more than likely is a time bomb.

[Thor Hammer]

@Shredhead86; Looking at the vanes closely you can see pieces missing! Dude, stop driving on that thing as those metal particles are making their way into your engine. The turbo is constantly spinning so no manner of "easy driving" will save your ass.

Jump on facebook and become a member of the Mazdaspeed 6 group and/or Mazdaspeed 6 Real Owners. You can get a used turbo from one of those guys for around $100.

You can afford that right? Otherwise you'll be spending 3-4K for a used block soon. Need help? Reach out to your local Nator group.

[Shredhead86]

Yeah. I posted on Fb too and one of the guys there offered an OEM turbo that’s at 84,000 miles for $75 plus shipping. Looks like I know what I’ll be doing this Saturday.

[Shredhead86]

I really appreciate all the input.

[MSMS3]

That compressor wheel looks terrible. I wonder if the engine has been sucking in unfiltered air -- something abrasive has been going on.

I'm attaching a photo of my K04 right before I removed it. You can see the broken vane at the bottom center of the photo. If you look closely, you can also see the scrape marks on the very inside of the inlet pipe.

On the other hand, I had no evidence of abrasion to the blades. They looked otherwise pretty normal but for the broken vane. There was considerable shaft play, explaining the broken vane.

It's clearly time for OP to replace that turbo and to find and fix whatever is doing the abrasion damage to the blades. Must be a big pre-turbo leak somewhere, sucking in unfiltered air full of micro particles of dirt, dust, and sand.

[Shredhead86]

There’s no telling. I’ve only had this car since August and what I’ve seen of the “mods” the previous owner had installed really leads me to question their thought process. For instance, they had put a CAI on the OEM TIP. I just put a CorkSport TIP and SRI on this month. I found a used K04 that will at least hold me over until I can afford a better turbo. Thanks again for the input.

[Thor Hammer]

Maybe the PO was running without an air filter or a really bad intake leak somewhere.

Regardless, glad you found one for a decent price. Where are you located?

[Shredhead86]

Greenville, Sc

[MoMS3]

Originally Posted by Shredhead86 There’s no telling. I’ve only had this car since August and what I’ve seen of the “mods” the previous owner had installed really leads me to question their thought process. For instance, they had put a CAI on the OEM TIP. I just put a CorkSport TIP and SRI on this month. I found a used K04 that will at least hold me over until I can afford a better turbo. Thanks again for the input.

If you haven't done a compression/leakdown test yet, you really should before you do anything tune-wise. With that much vane loss and the unknown source of abrasive material, who knows how much damage it did to the motor as well. The last thing you want is to get everything replaced only to ZZB shortly after all your hard work and money being spent.

[MSMS3]

Originally Posted by Shredhead86 There’s no telling. I’ve only had this car since August and what I’ve seen of the “mods” the previous owner had installed really leads me to question their thought process. For instance, they had put a CAI on the OEM TIP. I just put a CorkSport TIP and SRI on this month. I found a used K04 that will at least hold me over until I can afford a better turbo. Thanks again for the input.

I have been running the AEM/Mazdaspeed full CAI on the stock TIP for damn near 10 years, making 300 whp with catless dp/rp on the stock K04 and now BNR 1 on 93 pump gas. That pretty much maxes out the stock turbo on pump gas. Look elsewhere for your leak than assuming that a CAI and stock TIP are the problem. BTW, stock TIP, despite its shape, outflows the K04. A different style stock diameter TIP is not a power mod on a K04.

Any intake, improperly designed or installed, can be the source of a massive pre turbo leak. Also, a leaking bpv or vacuum line from it back to the TIP, or a broken or damaged nipple on the TIP could be sucking in unfiltered air.

Since you replaced much of that, maybe you fixed it. Be sure, because more than your turbo is at stake. Unfiltered air is like sandpaper, damaging pistons, rings, cylinder walls.

[Shredhead86]

I’m pretty sure I’ve got it now. One of the bolts holding the BOV in place wasn’t getting enough thread to hold it down. I’m pretty sure that’s what’s causing it.

[MazdaspeedYates]

Hi new to the forums.
every thread on this issue ive seen is on a modded speed. i have a 2011 Speed3 that is completely stock. Is this a normal issue around 84k miles?

[Jeff23spl]

which specific issue do you mean ? A whining noise? a broken compressor wheel or a leaking pipe ?

a clogged air filter in a stock speed can reduce the turbo lifespan by stressing the thrust bearing but most of the time there is a leak somewhere making the noise.

[MazdaspeedYates]

The whining noise. Started last night but it got much louder this morning. I havnt lost any boost so i dont think its a leak.

[Jeff23spl]

Originally Posted by MazdaspeedYates The whining noise. Started last night but it got much louder this morning. I havnt lost any boost so i dont think its a leak.

you can have a small leak that you won't notice by boost loss, you need to do a leak test to begin with and check your compressor wheel

[MazdaspeedYates]

Thanks ill try it and see how it goes.

[MSMS3]

Wear of the center shaft of the K04 is what causes the compressor wheel vane scraping or strikes. You should be able to see that on inspection. Check for end to end and side to side play on the shaft by moving it in and out and back and forth. Look for scrape marks or damage to the compressor wheel.

The center shaft of the K04 is very small -- 4mm, and it will eventually wear, regardless of whether you are tuned or stock. Tuned might wear quicker, but wear will occur. An example of accelerated wear on tuned cars is the effect of exhaust gas temperature. That little 4mm shaft will lose its hardness if exposed to exhaust gas temperatures above 1500 degrees F. That is not likely to happen on stock tune, but can on a tuned car if it is pushed to boost above 15 psi at 6,000 rpm. But, those are tuned cars -- badly tuned ones.

Wear will eventually happen on stock tune, too, just much slower.

I've had quite a few turbo cars, including Saabs and Volvos in addition to Mazdas. Turbos wear out. It is the bearings and seals. Seals are more likely to go in a modified car with higher boost, but center shaft bearing wear is more related to such things as how often you go WOT (even on a stock engine), and how regularly you change the oil and filter.

I think every turbo car I ever owned, even those that were stock, never made it to 100,000 miles before the turbo needed replacing. The turbo spins at over 100,000 rpm. Think about that. Those bearings will wear out over time regardless.

Only way to know is to pull the intake and turbo inlet pipe and look at the compressor wheel and move it to test for back and forth or in and out wobble.

[MazdaspeedYates]

Thank you so much for the info. Im hoping its just a leak but i should find out this weekend.

[Jeff23spl]

exact i opened few blown k04 to see internals damages and all got the center bushing loose.
For the seals, most of them also had baked oil or carbon around the shaft and seal. Just not sure which came first...was it the burned oil under the seals that made it to wear out or the oil get there because the seal was worn out....I don't know...

But i know 1 thing, when you run a turbo sport car, you should be prepared to replace the turbo soon or later...The small k04 spin so fast to keep up, that the bushing wear out and large one than could spin slower wear out on the thrust because it surge a bit.
Some may last a bit longer than some others but it remain a consumable part like brake pads or wheel bearing lol