Boost leak? showing 12psi only

[Kalandoss]

Only noticed it after I got my AP. It never goes over 12psi,(mazdaspeed 6) i have the OTS 98 stage 1 map. I reflashed it back to stock and back to the stage 1 map, which was recommended in a similar thread but nothing happened. Can someone take a look at my log and be able to pin point whats wrong? would be greatly appreciated.

Also everything is stock, only mod is a HKS BOV

my log was in 3rd gear from 2k rpm to redline.

[Killer95GT302]

Does this happen to you with the stock map? Boost definitely is low, and WGDC only goes higher thru the pull. I think it would be helpful to attach the map as well.

[MD1032]

Boost seems on the low side to me considering how much WG you're running. Your AFR's are solid, though. Doesn't seem like a boost leak.

Please take another log where you are actually WOT (you aren't) for at least 3000-6200 RPM or so and we'll take a look at it

[Agent_Orange]

Originally Posted by MD1032 Please take another log where you are actually WOT (you aren't) for at least 3000-6200 RPM or so and we'll take a look at it

75% Throttle is WOT.

Originally Posted by Kalandoss Only noticed it after I got my AP. It never goes over 12psi,(mazdaspeed 6) i have the OTS 98 stage 1 map. I reflashed it back to stock and back to the stage 1 map, which was recommended in a similar thread but nothing happened. Can someone take a look at my log and be able to pin point whats wrong? would be greatly appreciated. Also everything is stock, only mod is a HKS BOV my log was in 3rd gear from 2k rpm to redline.

First, you shouldn't being going WOT under 3000 rpm, unless you want a new bay window in your block.

Second, you shouldn't be running a VTA BOV without a custom tune.

Are you running these logs with traction control on? If not, check that your BCS and lines are hooked up correctly and that your wastegate actuator moves freely.

[MD1032]

Originally Posted by Agent_Orange 75% Throttle is WOT.

Most of the log isn't 75% throttle position for some reason, though. See attached, I highlighted all of the cells that aren't >=75% above 3000 RPM. Also like NCSpecV81 said, fuel trims are still showing up for God knows what reason. This log is fubar. After seeing shit like that, I would probably reflash the map at a bare minimum, if not reinstall the AP. When was the last time the AP was updated?

Originally Posted by MSMS3 Maybe if he puts his stock BPV back on and connects it to recirc, he can solve multiple problems and get boost back to normal.

VTA isn't the issue here. VTA causes a lot of problems (I would never run it), but there shouldn't be any at WOT unless it's leaking, and even then, on an MS6 or Genwon, you'd see AFR's tank if that were the case. There are tuning adjustments you are indeed supposed to make so that the car doesn't shit itself during shifting, but these shouldn't affect a simple WOT pull.

[NCspecV81]

What I find odd is that you are in a perpetual state of closed loop. At some point in time during your log your LTFT and STFT should be relegated to 0, which generally means you've transisted to open loop. Yours does not.

Do you have any CEL's? Could be a faulty sensor somewhere.

I would flash back to the stock map and take a log. See what happens. That would at least rule out software.

[littleloogy]

You try to hide you porn in your intake again?

At first, it looks like you are on spring pressure like your EBCS took a shit, But further down the log it looks like you can't even reach spring pressure. Maybe your filter is clogged with leaves or you have a boost leak maybe at your BOV???


Sent from my iPhone 6

[MSMS3]

Maybe if he puts his stock BPV back on and connects it to recirc, he can solve multiple problems and get boost back to normal.

[MSMS3]

^ I'm saying two birds could be killed with one stone if the VTA BOV is leaking. He could stop the leak and restore recirc. I'm primarily concerned about a BOV leak as a possible contributing issue and swapping to the stock BPV might tell us if that cured the problem. The secondary benefit would be recirc drivability restored.

He seems to be staying in closed state and not transitioning to open state at WOT.. If he is dumping a lot of boost to atmosphere through a leaking valve, perhaps he would stay in closed state. I don't know.

[Kalandoss]

okay so i re-installed the stock BOV and did a log from 3rd gear to redline. I noticed the boost peaking around 13.8, so it has increased... but still not enough for a stage 1 map right?

I also re-flashed to stock, and re-flashed back to stage 1 incase there was a software issue. The AP is 2 weeks old and also updated the firmware when I got it.

[MD1032]

I don't even know where to start with this one. It's late, I'm tired, and very confused.

Again, you have this weird issue with increasing throttle position slowly through the course of the log instead of going WOT (74-80%) right off the bat. Then you have spark advance values that are just totally wrong (way too high) for the loads you're at and the map you're running. And then you still have short term fuel trims showing up for some reason. And low boost. And your AFR's are going rich in the top end like you're getting knock or are leaking air, but the KR column is all zeroes. It's just plain low.

Also, that LTFT of -14 right before you go WOT has me worried. You sure you don't have a leak on the pressurized side of the system? Could be something simple like a boost tube.

I'm gonna tag a local MS6 owner. Maybe he'll have some insight because I have a different ECU than you guys.

@f15ms6;

[Kalandoss]

I just did a log with the stock map. Boost peak reached 15.4psi...

Still in my car doing a few more runs so I'll post the log soon.

@md1032

Originally Posted by MD1032 I don't even know where to start with this one. It's late, I'm tired, and very confused. Again, you have this weird issue with increasing throttle position slowly through the course of the log instead of going WOT (74-80%) right off the bat. Then you have spark advance values that are just totally wrong (way too high) for the loads you're at and the map you're running. And then you still have short term fuel trims showing up for some reason. And low boost. And your AFR's are going rich in the top end like you're getting knock or are leaking air, but the KR column is all zeroes. It's just plain low. Also, that LTFT of -14 right before you go WOT has me worried. You sure you don't have a leak on the pressurized side of the system? Could be something simple like a boost tube. I'm gonna tag a local MS6 owner. Maybe he'll have some insight because I have a different ECU than you guys. @f15ms6;

Kalandoss I just did a log with the stock map. Boost peak reached 15.4psi...

Still in my car doing a few more runs so I'll post the log soon.

[Kalandoss]

Okay so here it is. Looking at it I have no idea why the throttle position is fluctuating so much. I made sure my foot was firmly on the ground the entire time. this was on the stock base map.

[Vansquish]

Originally Posted by Kalandoss Okay so here it is. Looking at it I have no idea why the throttle position is fluctuating so much. I made sure my foot was firmly on the ground the entire time. this was on the stock base map.

LMAO...I don't think I've ever seen STFTs in the 60s.

[MD1032]

Please keep in mind that Cobb's "Stage 0" map is not actually the stock map. It is an imitation of the stock map using Cobb's software. If something is wrong with the AP or the software installed on it, flashing to Stage 0 won't help.

Also, peak boost isn't really useful because boost spikes will happen and cause the "peak" to be erratic.

There's something seriously wrong here, no doubt about it. That last log is a mess as you can tell.

At this point I would uninstall the AP from the vehicle, take it into your house, reinstall the software on it, then delete all of the maps on it, download new maps, and flash the Stage 1 v234 map.

edit: Also, based on the richening of the AFR's in the top end in your last log, I would say it is safe to say that you have a sizeable boost leak between the turbo and the intake valves. I would do the above before you chase this down, though, just in case it's a software glitch.

[anavrinIV]

VTA with an HKS requires no tuning and won't cause any problems. I've been driving that way for 3 years with exactly 0 issues. So unless the valve is broken that's not it.

In the last log your throttle position never gets to a WOT state and your AFRs drop to 9s. Record Accelerator Pedal position so we can see when you have your foot to the floor. If your foot is hard down (which we can't verify in this log) then your car is closing the throttle plate but you're reading decent g/s with very low boost up top.

[btstarcher]

Maybe a bad TPS?

[Killer95GT302]

Originally Posted by btstarcher Maybe a bad TPS?

That or maybe faulty throttle actuator (motor on TB)? Did you ever run the stock map?

[f15ms6]

Wow bro I hope you didnt already damaged things. Please! Never go WOT or get into boost under 3k rpm between 2nd-4th gears. 4500 5-6th gear.

With regards to the boost, make sure that the turbo tubes are tight and are not leaking. Are you running a SRI/CAI? If yes what size ?

Also leave the VTA off, we to do custom tunes to run them on our cars. Our ECU logic was designed for the factory rec valve. Since you were running the VTA did you had the recirculation tube connected to something or just detached from one end?

[MD1032]

Originally Posted by f15ms6 Wow bro I hope you didnt already damaged things. Please! Never go WOT or get into boost under 3k rpm between 2nd-4th gears. 4500 5-6th gear. With regards to the boost, make sure that the turbo tubes are tight and are not leaking. Are you running a SRI/CAI? If yes what size ? Also leave the VTA off, we to do custom tunes to run them on our cars. Our ECU logic was designed for the factory rec valve. Since you were running the VTA did you had the recirculation tube connected to something or just detached from one end?

The HKS is the one Zach runs. It doesn't even have the option to recirc.

[f15ms6]

Originally Posted by MD1032 The HKS is the one Zach runs. It doesn't even have the option to recirc.

True, thats why you have to tune for it.. The factory map is designed with the recirc valve in mind, not having it attached will result in issues. even more if he is leaving the recirc port open in the tip.

[anavrinIV]

Originally Posted by f15ms6 True, thats why you have to tune for it.. The factory map is designed with the recirc valve in mind, not having it attached will result in issues. even more if he is leaving the recirc port open in the tip.

Only the last part of your statement is true. The HKS requires no specific tuning. NONE. HKS has a recirc option but drivability was weird to me when I tried it so I took it back off and have run it that way for 3 YEARS with no problems.

Everyone, get it out of your heads than and HKS BOV will cause any problem like this. That's not the problem.

[MD1032]

I assume he was smart enough to plug that with something.

[btstarcher]

Likewise. I saw rich AFR's after letting off the gas, and between shifts, sometimes resulting in afterfire, but that's it. That's the only thing that needs to be corrected. MAF calibration was easily dialed in and drivability was excellent.

[btstarcher]

STFT can only be +/- 25....?

[btstarcher]

BAT's at 35 degrees? Wtf....

[Killer95GT302]

Originally Posted by btstarcher BAT's at 35 degrees? Wtf....

Hmm says thats in Celcius - about 95 fahrenheit

[Jeff23spl]

subbed to see the outcome but that TB position is very strange...like if something would be there to force reducing the throttle opening. Can the op be touching the brake pedal while starting the log ? Probably not but just in case....

[btstarcher]

Maybe cleaning the TB?

[btstarcher]

After looking at the 1st log and comparing it to the last one, either the MAF cal was far from stock or you really fucked up the BPV installation. The 1st log looks almost fine, with exception of the boost being low.

[Jeff23spl]

exept for the strange low TB position, few things point toward a leak like:
The good g/s under low boost.
40+% of STFT... I never seen it that high!

A damaged turbo would not boost at all and a broken wastegate system won't trigger +40% of STFT...
If the op is using the stock tmic, it limit the things to check,...only 4 clamps and 2 rubber hose to remove, inspect for crack and carrefully put back. and....it come the bov...!
Even if you have a very good branded BOV, it isn't impossible that it fail or have a leak between IC and BOV flange...

Originally Posted by btstarcher STFT can only be +/- 25....?

when it goes above or below 25, it trigger a cell on my gen 1, i ran into it with a dirty MAF...

[Kalandoss]

Originally Posted by MD1032 Please keep in mind that Cobb's "Stage 0" map is not actually the stock map. It is an imitation of the stock map using Cobb's software. If something is wrong with the AP or the software installed on it, flashing to Stage 0 won't help. Also, peak boost isn't really useful because boost spikes will happen and cause the "peak" to be erratic. There's something seriously wrong here, no doubt about it. That last log is a mess as you can tell. At this point I would uninstall the AP from the vehicle, take it into your house, reinstall the software on it, then delete all of the maps on it, download new maps, and flash the Stage 1 v234 map. edit: Also, based on the richening of the AFR's in the top end in your last log, I would say it is safe to say that you have a sizeable boost leak between the turbo and the intake valves. I would do the above before you chase this down, though, just in case it's a software glitch.

alright I'll do this first and report back.

Originally Posted by btstarcher After looking at the 1st log and comparing it to the last one, either the MAF cal was far from stock or you really fucked up the BPV installation. The 1st log looks almost fine, with exception of the boost being low.

I re-installed the BOV correctly, made sure everything was tight and clamped.

I appreciate everyone trying to help me, I'll post up another log, when I re-format the AP with a stage 1 map.

[Kalandoss]

Ok, so I un-married the AP3, deleted all the maps, installed the stage 1, 98ron map, and went for another run.

log 1 is in 4th gear, and log 2 is in 3rd.

Looking at it now, i'm basically losing about 1psi of boost only right? as the map states peak is at 15psi tapering down to 13.5 (-+1.5psi)

[btstarcher]

Still less than 13psi. What's your elevation? Also are the non-US ECU's different?

[Kalandoss]

Originally Posted by btstarcher Still less than 13psi. What's your elevation? Also are the non-US ECU's different?

689 feet above sea level according to those websites that measure elevation. And that's what I was wondering as well.. Are there any AUS specific maps available from cobb?

[btstarcher]

@snailD; or @rfinkle2; any ideas?

[Killer95GT302]

I wonder if its helpful to get a log at idle just to see what the ECU is doing in that situation, maybe take a look at vacuum and fuel trims there.

[snailD]

honestly the throttle position isn't a worry. you will see a self adjusting throttle position when targets are met. say if you target 1.7 load, and you hit 1.7 load with 18psi when you target 19psi, you will see a reduction in throttle and wastegate duty cycle. throttle self fluctuates alot at tip in at low rpms especially around 3k as that is usually when we allow the motor to make power. 2500 targets are usually pretty low resulting in the throttle you see here. you can easily manipulate the throttle to not oscilate by changing the 80 values in the DBW to 90, then it can't self adjust and will do what you say. I would do a boost leak test first off, if you havent done one yet, a real one, and eliminate any vaccume leaks double check everything. its very possible the map you are using is the culprit especially if you saw more peak boost on a stock map. i would say there isn't overly concerning here just an issue with the tune and/or hardware. originally i would have said your boost controller seems to be not working but since you gained boost switching maps that is kind of ruled out

[Jeff23spl]

I agree, the AP won't fix a leak...he should borrow a boost tester, open the hood and test it before going too far in the mapping things especialy when using stock parts...

[MD1032]

At this point if it were me, I would contact Cobb directly and ask them under what circumstances the AP will still show STFT's at WOT for your vehicle. That is too weird to ignore.

I do second a boost leak test, but I would hook the thing right up to the intake to check for leaks there as well, even though that area technically isn't designed to hold pressure.